Board Thread:Legitimate Canon Questions/@comment-70.42.157.5-20141005164721/@comment-6383956-20141018152711

LadyX wrote:

Grahamburglar wrote: If I may disagree with you, LadyX, I'm finding your definition of what makes a female character a "strong female character" really limited. Lydia has gone from utterly clueless and losing her mind to an invaluable member of the team -- and she still manages to hang onto that same attitude that we initially saw as shallow and vapid. Just because a character likes to wear heels, doesn't make them less of a good example of feminism. Neither does an active sex life.

Allison's story arc -- straight up until her death -- was in total defiance of the tropes of the genre. She was the love interest -- and, yes, in the supernatural genre that does often entail joining the fight before the end (rather than being all damsel in distress) but it seldom involves breaking up with the main character and it virtually never involves moving on, as Allison did with Isaac. Allison, yes, went pretty much psycho -- but if you're going to hold that against her as something that keeps her from being a strong character, I'm going to have to point out Derek being manipulated by Peter in S1 and Stiles' whole thing with the nogitsune. In fact, having agency taken from you by supernatural means or simple treachery has happened to all of the main characters at one point or another, it's one of the themes of the show. It doesn't keep her from being a strong female character. Her moving on was kind of voided by the fact that her dying breath was for Scott when her current boyfriend was less than ten feet away, don't you think?

As far as lydia... You're right, you can be bad ass and feminist in heels and have sex. But up until this season, 90% of her scenes had to do with dependence on a man for happiness. Which is not feminist at all. Or indicative of strong character. We bitch when Scott is girl crazy, but it's strong when Lydia is boy crazy?

Part of the issue is, I think, I misspoke when I said they weren't strong female characters. They are strong female characters. They just aren't strong role models.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy her character. And Allison (when she wasn't batshit) I just...wouldn't particularly want my hypothetical daughter looking up to either of them. That's why I said "until her death" not "through her death". :P

I disagree that Lydia's scenes had to dependence on a man (arguably in S1 because she wasn't well developed yet, arguably in S2 although the end of the season made it seem more like Jackson depended on her than the other way around) -- she was never dependent on Aiden though, except depending on him to feed her at least a litle bit of information about the Alpha Pack while they were screwing around.

And we bitch when Scott is girl crazy because literally that's all he would think about. Lydia can manage to be boy crazy and do other things with her life. At the same time. That's the strong part. :P

And the question was never if they're strong role models. They're deeply flawed characters, that's part of what makes them strong characters to begin with. And, really, should you be suggesting your hypothetical daughter look up to teenagers? Have you met teenagers? :P